John Mulder
An interview with John Mulder President of Master Finish
“Once I got here, I didn’t feel like there were any blinders I needed to wear, there wasn’t any ceiling that I needed to bust through.”
Getting to Know John Personally
Tell us about yourself.
I am 44 years old. I am a Father of two, in a mixed family with four kids living under my roof. I'm married to Trisha. I have four daughters basically, 13, 15, 17, and 20. We've been in that living situation now for four years since I got married to Trisha on the 20th of May, four years ago. I am an Eagle Scout. I am an industrial engineer by education and leading a business by trade, by experience. I went to high school at East Kentwood High School. Then I went to college at Grand Rapids Community College and then transferred to Western Michigan University. I thought I was going to be an engineer the whole time. In fact, I thought I was going to work in the plastics field, so I have a minor in plastics engineering and my major is industrial engineering. I thought I was going to work in plastics because my Dad at the time owned two businesses a chrome plating company and a plastics injection molding company. In fact, my original plan was to transfer to Ferris from Grand Rapids Community College for the plastics engineering program. Two years into my college education, my Dad sold the plastics company, so I decided to go get a little bit more general education in engineering where I could go into any field. Then when I graduated from college, I worked at a couple of different plastics companies for about 10 years before I came back to the family business, Master Finish, doing fabrication type of work on sheet stock at Total Plastics. Then I went to Fabri-Kal in Kalamazoo and did large scale thermal forming like food packaging, yogurt containers, drinking cups, those kinds of things. In 2008 my Dad's business partner was going to retire, so I came to the family business at that point. Actually, in 2010, I finally made the move. 2008 was not a good year to move into an automotive based chrome plating company. We were hit very hard by the 2008 recession. By 2010 the timing seemed right.
Tell me a little bit about Dad's business. How did he come by the business? How long did he have the business before you got involved?
Master Finish was founded by my Grandfather in 1959. We're a third-generation family business. My Dad started here at Master Finish in 1978 when I was one year old and was the President for the vast majority of his time here. My Grandfather was born here, a son of two immigrants. They had a family bakery. Before the Master Finish company was the Sanitary Bakery. The Sanitary Bakery, my Grandfather and his family lived upstairs and ran the bakery during the day. He has four siblings. Entrepreneurship was always in his blood. When he was done with high school, he had a friend who started doing vibratory deburring, so he went and bought a couple of vibratory deburring machines to take a zinc die-cast component and take the sharp edges off of it so that it could be finished. So he started with a couple vibing machines in the basement of an auto body shop. That business grew. He met up with a guy who designed and built those machines. This other guy ran the machine sales as his business partner. My Grandfather then ran the job shop where he would use the machines to process parts for people. At some point, there was a falling out on how they wanted to run the business so my Grandfather started Master Finishing and Deburring Company, here at the location where we are now at 1160 Burton, back in 1959. Built the building, put in the machines, and got started. At that point, it was a 15,000 square foot building and he had three or four vibratory finishers. I think at that time he was doing tumbling, so a different type of equipment, and then added vibratory bowls later on and more processes. At some point in the early 60's they got involved with a couple key players at different plating companies, who were upset with their boss on how they were running the plating company, and offered them a job to come work with him to get a plating line started up. That's what they did. They jumped ship from his customers and they started a plating line sometime in the early 60s. Then we added additional plating lines and added additional equipment and processes and options and finishes. As time evolved from the 60s to 2020 a lot of change in what the industry requires.
President of Master Finish
when you joined in 2010, what was your role and the transition from that role to today?
When I started in 2010, my role was cost estimator. We would have customers looking for the pricing on a particular part and I would put together all the costs for that and add some margin to it and give them a quote for the work. That was a lot of my background at previous jobs. I did that exact same function so I was familiar with how to gather up costs and estimate what the cost would be to build something. A lot of that was just working with customers so I added in a process on how we will develop and launch products. Which to this day we still modify, work on and try to improve on because effectively launching a product is very important. We've added a lot of automation. I've been involved with a lot of project work. Today I'm kind of leading the sales and marketing efforts. My Father retired a couple of years ago. Now I'm the President of a company in what we call a visionary role. My brother, who I recruited to join about six years ago, he's doing the integrator role. For anyone who knows what EOS is, that's how we've decided to break the roles apart. I look more at what are the outside forces acting on our company and my brother takes the internal processing of components and manages that portion of the work. I'm dealing with vendors and customers and finances and all of those things in a business that you have to deal with. My brother is dealing with the internal processes, people, and those types of functions.
What's something that really excites you professionally right now?
New opportunities, new markets to serve, new finishes. I'm excited about marketing and sharing with the world, some of the new capabilities we have like black chrome, satin nickels, and getting those out in front of new OEMs, new manufacturers of products so we can show them how they can differentiate their products from their competitors.
What is something you've enjoyed about your journey as a leader?
When I started out as an engineer, the engineering functions were very mathematical, very logical. What I've enjoyed is, as my career has progressed, there's been a lot more of my time working with people, and working with products. To me, that transition to working with people has been fulfilling. I enjoy creating relationships with people. I enjoy working with others and creating a team culture, trying to solve big long-term problems with processes is much more enjoyable than crunching numbers on the cost of a part. I like that I can build something. I feel like I'm building something that's bigger than myself.
Historically, multi-generation companies don't make it. what's your response to that?
Thanks for the reminder. It's been a huge blessing to be part of it. When I first started down this road of working with my Dad, I had to pull him to let me come work here. I think a lot of companies that are family-owned, as those generations go on there's so many people in the family involved in the business, that the business is suffocated by the family. I think there's times where there's, seven cousins, three aunts and uncles and everything involved in the family business, it's very hard for that type of structure to be effective when there's people who are depending on the business for their livelihood, that are not actively involved in the business. I think it was very important for my Father in his generation and for me and my generation to set some kind of boundaries between the family and the business. One of those is, if you want to be involved in the business, in any ownership, you have to be involved in the business as an employee. I think that draws a line that keeps the company effective and efficient. As leaders in the business, my brother and I are the only ones that have any ownership in the business at this point. We're both working here full time. That means that if we have a bad month or year and we're not earning a profit we can share, our family is not affected by that. So keeping the family pruned from the business, keeping the business effective, is important especially going through tough times like we're just coming out of.
“I think it was very important for my Father in his generation and for me and my generation to set some kind of boundaries between the family and the business.”
What do you think was holding you back from becoming a leader?
I think in previous companies, I was put into a role that they weren't expecting or there wasn't opportunities for leadership. Growing up I've always enjoyed leading people. I've always enjoyed seeing how I can be impactful in helping others. Once I got here, I didn't feel like there were any blinders I needed to wear, there wasn't any ceiling that I needed to bust through. I had that opportunity here. It was great to be able to just blossom in that way.
Why do you think people follow you?
I think people follow me because they can trust me. I think they follow me because I can share a vision with them that they can use to see where we're trying to go. I think people follow me because I can relate, I'm relatable. I think being honorable and trustworthy, I'm a person of integrity, I think they feel that they can stand behind what I'm going to say and know that I will stand behind what I say as well.
What do you think you learned about leadership the hard way?
A lot. I think what took a while to come to me was that everyone has different objectives in life. I think some people are content with the way things are going and don't see the benefit of change. I think managing change has been harder than I had anticipated. I think sometimes casting a vision, even when done very repetitively, my initial thought as a leader was that if I can continuously tell them the same message and we make progress towards that, people will jump on board, and what I have found is that many do. There are some that see a different vision, a vision of consistency being more important. Change is harder than I would have ever anticipated it to be leading an organization.
Is there a particular situation that comes to mind that you've had to struggle through?
Recently, we've added performance bonuses. We've created Standard Work out on our shop floor. Those who are direct labor, they can earn a bonus by outperforming the standard labor. They can earn extra money. It's not required, but it's an opportunity. We post how well you're doing out on the shop floor. We've had several people just not appreciate that and they left our company when we gave an opportunity because they didn't want to be held accountable for their work rate. We've seen a lot of change and turnover of people just by posting what they can potentially earn as a bonus. Those who are not doing that, look at that board as something completely different. I still think it's the right thing to do and it's rewarding those who are stellar performers. It is hard on the guy who's not meeting the standard and not getting these bonuses. They’ve got a reminder of that.
How do you not buckle in the face of that adversity?
You've got 80% of the people that are earning a bonus for this, so you've got 20% that are disappointed. You've got a company that's growing so we're trying to add more people. I think we're trying to hire 17 people right now. We have about 100. We're really in an aggressive growth phase right now. We have to look at what's best for everyone overall and have those conversations with the exceptions. For some it's maybe not going to be the right place for them. You have to realize that as you make changes, it's not going to fit everyone. It's going to be better if you can constantly be better for the majority of people, then you are moving the needle in the right direction. Can't be everything for everyone.
“Change is harder than I would have ever anticipated it to be leading an organization. ”
Have you ever had an “I've made it” moment ?
No I don't feel like I've made it yet, no. I'm on the struggle bus there. I'm constantly grinding trying to figure out how I can do better.
How are you trying to do better? what are you doing?
I mean, we're constantly looking at the issues that come up, the quality problems, that lack of expected profitability, shortness of people out on our team to serve our customers. That's where my time is more focused. We've had great things happen. We've gotten some of the largest orders from customers ever this year. It's the largest single purchase order to launch program. It's great, but I look at it and we're not profitable, we're losing money every month and we're doing it in a bigger fashion than we've ever done before. So there's not that feeling of success yet. Overall, we're making the actions to move the needle in the right direction all the time constantly trying to push but I’ll have the feeling that I've made it when we have a couple of years where we've turned a reasonable profit after my Father's left and we're starting to see that continuous growth and stability. It's been a tough go for the last couple of years.
What do you struggle with most? Time, I don't have enough time to do it all. Team, how do I get them to do it? Or money, I don't have enough or how do I get more?
There's probably times in my life where I've struggled more with any one of those. Right now as we sit here today it's a toss-up between time and team. We're trying to grow our staff by 15 to 20% over the next couple months. That's a big burden on time because we need the team wrapped around this to be successful. They all kind of correlate, right. When you're short on team, your time gets burned out. If you've got enough team, your money gets burned out, so they're all correlated. They're all interchangeable and exchangeable. They're all finite.
If you had a favorite quote, or mantra, something you say over and over to yourself, what would that be and why?
I've got one posted on my desk. That is the four principles of relationship that I got from my Grandfather. It's called the four-way test. It's from Rotary and it's the four things to consider before you make any big important decision.
Is it the truth?
Is it fair to all concerned?
Will it build goodwill and better friendships?
And will it be beneficial to all concerned?
It's just something in front of me all day long. I think about that when I'm making an important decision on how we're going to handle customer service, how we're going to handle a problem with a vendor, or an issue that comes up. It's just something that if you can think through those four questions and make sure it's the right thing to do for everyone, then you'll be thinking with that much longer-term strategy than you would making a quick tactical decision that can really affect people, positions, relationships, which are way more important than that minor tactical decision you're probably making.
What's the best advice you ever received?
It was probably "here read this book". It's a book called Traction by Gino Wickman. My Father gave me that advice and helped us implement EOS in our workplace.
Was he using EOS when he ran the business or didn't it exist?
Before I started at Master Finish, he was not. When I started the first five years I was here, we were not using EOS. When my brother joined the company, we started using EOS as a way to try to understand how we could handle the workload properly between the three of us and through the transition. We didn't know if it was going to be something that was going to stick or not. We didn't know how it was going to work. That EOS platform really set our ways in motion and gave us a platform to communicate better and work better together and a common understanding.
I know you're a big advocate of EOS, also self-implemented.
Self-implemented. We did have someone come in and work with us at the very beginning just to make sure we were all on the same page. We needed a mediator, lots of big ideas rolling around and not all of them can stick. It all worked out in the end. It's something that I've mentored others on now and shared our model with other people. I hope to be able to do that in the future with others. I think it's been a great program for us and is for many companies. That whole platform is gaining so much ground nowadays.
If you had to pick one “must do” from EOS, what would that be?
Complete a vision traction organizer. I would say if there's a one B, it would be understand level 10 meetings. If you can make meetings worthwhile, everybody appreciates it.
“The only way you stay sane through all of that is by having a plan that when things turn around, you can implement. ”
Share with us a time when you flat out failed. You came up against an obstacle or challenge and it was so tough you had to dig deep to overcome, how did you overcome it?
I put my full effort into so many things and there's not one that just jumps out at me. I have worked my tail off to get this black chrome approved and implemented. I haven't worked harder on a single program or project in my life. It's been almost three years and we're just finally starting to produce parts this month. Everything from getting the chemistry to work right, to getting the OEMs to think that this was a viable solution, to showing them how I can save them money, and I'm literally saving millions of dollars for these people at the car manufacturing company. Convincing them that this could be a good option and convincing other people in the supply chain and working through three tiers of automotive supply chains to get something that we developed into the market has been a huge battle. We've expensed hundreds and hundreds of thousands of dollars to do it and just last week I got my first check for some product being sold. There's still a lot of red tape that we're paying for but some return on that investment is yet to be seen. All plans are in place for us to make this effort worthwhile but it hasn't happened yet. It's plagued by other issues and getting the other vendors up to speed and getting their work done so that we can get parts out on time and all of these other things that we rolled into this package to make it nice and easy and attractive to the OEM, it's still all yet to be seen. You can't anticipate all the missteps that can happen. Then a whole year of delay for COVID, because there weren't engineers that were willing to work on this future project, they were trying to keep cars being produced at the time. For the whole year of delay and a whole year of those costs not going anywhere and COVID itself was a huge change for our business too. We had a whole quarter where our sales were down 65%. It hit us pretty hard.
How do you overcome all of that adversity, the challenges of COVID, and the delays?
I'm glad we can. I'm glad we've been able to secure the financing we need to keep afloat, to make decisions that keep our team ahead, happy, content with what's going on, to be able to retain the people that we need to run this business when supply chains return. The only way you stay sane through all of that is by having a plan that when things turn around, you can implement. Having a long-term vision and then trying to stick to that as best as possible but being pretty darn flexible in the meantime. You don't get there without faith. You have to believe that there's a lesson to be learned. God's got something going on in the background for this to all make sense down the road, a lesson to learn or a value that he's trying to instill in you and maybe its patience. Maybe that's what God's trying to tell me. I need to be more of a patient person. I don't know. I'll tell you 20 years from now what I learned today.
Random Thoughts
Progress or perfection?
Progress, perfection doesn't exist.
Who are your greatest influences?
I would say my family, my parents were some of my greatest influences. The church has been a great influence for me to realize it's not about me, it's about those around me and how I can make waves for other people in their lives.
Name one core value that's not negotiable.
I have four core values that are not negotiable. They're posted all around our company
Teamwork
Honesty
Innovation
and Service.
If you could recommend one book, what would it be?
I already told you my book, Traction. You can put the Bible in there too. Both of those books.
Favorite technology catching your interest right now?
I guess it would be IOT (Internet of Things) where devices can be connected to the internet. We can use data from those devices to make decisions in real-time in our business.
How are you using that?
We're using that on all of our automated equipment to get real-time data on how the equipment is performing so that we can improve uptime and improve output.
favorite hobby?
Walking my dog. I really enjoy just going for walks. So walking, hiking, and then boating with my family. I got an open bow ski boat, Cobalt. I can pull my kids tubing around a lake for a whole weekend nonstop. They just have a great time.
Bucket list item.
I know if you ask my wife she would say, to stay in one of those cabanas that are over the water. I've done so many things, I don't have a bucket list. I've got a lot of long-term life goals, but those aren't your bucket list items like go skydiving, I've done that, go hang gliding, I've done that. I guess travel the world. I want to see places I haven't seen.
What will be your legacy?
Some of it will be in this company. Some of my legacy will be with the people I've either led to Christ or helped lead to Christ or build a relationship with Christ. It would be with my family with what I've been able to leave behind for them and the lessons I've instilled in my family that hopefully will be generational like the lessons I've gotten from my Grandfather. A legacy of generosity that I have given in time and finances to those things that I care about.
“A legacy of generosity that I have given in time and finances to those things that I care about.”
soapbox topic?
If you had a soapbox topic, what would it be?
EOS would be my soapbox topic and family business. I think there's been two big influences in my life. The relationships I've built with other business owners through the Family Business Alliance, and EOS, which is a model for running my business and I talk with anyone at any length about either of those topics.
What do you value most about attending the BLConnect events?
It's an opportunity to meet new people to share ideas and thoughts and build that network of trusted peers that you can share thoughts and ideas with. They say it's lonely at the top. It can be. There's not a lot of good feedback you'll get from those who are not your peers or in the same boat that you're in. I've been down that road before. It's just a great opportunity to meet people who may be able to help you when the time comes.
To learn more about John Mulder and Master Finish, check out their website @ https://masterfinishco.com/
Or
To meet John personally, join him for one of our BLConnect events